Thunderbird2 & Turbo Coupes

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scotty2
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Re: Thunderbird 2, The Green Machine & Turbo Coupes

Post by scotty2 » Fri Sep 16, 2022 9:29 am

TGM now back in service. MOT booked for Saturday... Must fabricate a sump guard of sorts.
800 Saloon, Fastback and Turbo Coupe!

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Re: Thunderbird 2, The Green Machine & Turbo Coupes

Post by scotty2 » Sun Sep 18, 2022 11:08 am

Whoo Hoo. TGM MOTd and only a couple of advisories. Deteriorated rubber ball joint covers as usual, but a surprising "rear brake disc worn, pitted or scored..." Strange because they were both replaced for last year's MOT?
More satisfying was the OK emissions which is after the new LPG reducer and Lambda sensor as part of last years work, so still ok. Replacement sump holding oil too!
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Re: Thunderbird 2, The Green Machine & Turbo Coupes

Post by scoobyh123 » Sun Sep 18, 2022 12:31 pm

Great news Scott! :thumbs_up:

I suspect the "advisory" about brake discs was either you've picked up a bit of grit and it's scratched one or both discs or he thought it had so stuck it down to "prove he'd looked at the car". With a very light scratch from a bit of grit, once it's gone the pads will clean the disc up again as if nothing had ever happened so he can't be accused of lying because the proof has gone. :roll:
Cheers,
Dave

'02 Honda CR-V SE Executive
'99 Jag S Type 3.0 V6 SE


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'94 827 Sterling saloon
'88 Volvo 760 V6 Estate
'95 827 Coupé LPG gone but not forgotten!

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Re: Thunderbird 2, The Green Machine & Turbo Coupes

Post by scotty2 » Tue Nov 01, 2022 3:13 pm

Just an update.
TB2 - Nothing to report.
TGM - Has an occasional misfire on start up when cold. Stutters a bit unless under a bit of throttle, when it pulls OK, but when warmed up, it's OK. This is on petrol by the way. Nothing untoward like sparking or clicking under the bonnet.
Any pointers to check out?
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Re: Thunderbird 2, The Green Machine & Turbo Coupes

Post by scoobyh123 » Tue Nov 01, 2022 3:52 pm

scotty2 wrote:
Tue Nov 01, 2022 3:13 pm
Just an update.
TB2 - Nothing to report.
TGM - Has an occasional misfire on start up when cold. Stutters a bit unless under a bit of throttle, when it pulls OK, but when warmed up, it's OK. This is on petrol by the way. Nothing untoward like sparking or clicking under the bonnet.
Any pointers to check out?
Add 0.5L of Carlube ATF or similar synthetic 32SAE ATF to the engine oil Scott - chances are you have a lazy hydraulic tappet and this is either sticking or not opening fully. It will also help free sticky piston rings that might also be the source of a cold misfire.

Nothing to lose except the cost of a bit of ATF and perhaps a lot to gain, it will help clean the emissions and revive any ageing rubber seals throughout the engine too. :wink: :D

It's not a miracle overnight cure, a few hundred miles of mixed driving should see results though.
Cheers,
Dave

'02 Honda CR-V SE Executive
'99 Jag S Type 3.0 V6 SE


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'94 827 Sterling saloon
'88 Volvo 760 V6 Estate
'95 827 Coupé LPG gone but not forgotten!

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Re: Thunderbird 2, The Green Machine & Turbo Coupes

Post by scotty2 » Tue Nov 01, 2022 4:06 pm

Cheers Dave. It has had a few oil changes (and sumps!) and the LPG keeps the oil clean, but I'll try the ATF trick anyway. Nothing to lose...
I'm sure it's damp/cold related, or part of the general haunted electrics it has. Well it was Halloween as well...
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Re: Thunderbird 2, The Green Machine & Turbo Coupes

Post by Marc-827-Vitesse » Sun Nov 13, 2022 10:12 pm

Wow. Nice to see 800's are being saved. First class on the paint job and congrats on the MOT. :)
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Re: Thunderbird 2, The Green Machine & Turbo Coupes

Post by scoobyh123 » Mon Nov 14, 2022 12:06 am

scotty2 wrote:
Tue Nov 01, 2022 4:06 pm
Cheers Dave. It has had a few oil changes (and sumps!) and the LPG keeps the oil clean, but I'll try the ATF trick anyway. Nothing to lose...
I'm sure it's damp/cold related, or part of the general haunted electrics it has. Well it was Halloween as well...
Any progress on the ATF trick Scott? If you've been using it sort of regularly there should be some improvement by now if you added the ATF just after i suggested it.

As for it being Halloween/Samhain, i didn't put a curse on it, honest! :P :lol:
Cheers,
Dave

'02 Honda CR-V SE Executive
'99 Jag S Type 3.0 V6 SE


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'94 827 Sterling saloon
'88 Volvo 760 V6 Estate
'95 827 Coupé LPG gone but not forgotten!

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Re: Thunderbird 2, The Green Machine & Turbo Coupes

Post by scotty2 » Mon Nov 21, 2022 1:15 pm

Progress, Dave, but not AFT related I suspect. The LPG stopped working on TGM. I plugged in the laptop (well the second laptop as the first one which I usually use wouldn't connect so I had to download the King software onto another one...) After it connected, I reset the faults, even though none showing, and the misfire went away, and the LPG started working again!

The AFT won't have done any harm though.
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Re: Thunderbird 2, The Green Machine & Turbo Coupes

Post by scoobyh123 » Mon Nov 21, 2022 1:22 pm

scotty2 wrote:
Mon Nov 21, 2022 1:15 pm
Progress, Dave, but not AFT related I suspect. The LPG stopped working on TGM. I plugged in the laptop (well the second laptop as the first one which I usually use wouldn't connect so I had to download the King software onto another one...) After it connected, I reset the faults, even though none showing, and the misfire went away, and the LPG started working again!

The AFT won't have done any harm though.
I find that strange Scott as the LPG doesn't work from cold and you mentioned a misfire from cold. The LPG will change over at a certain temperature, usually 30-40C as read from the reducer temperature sensor.

A cold misfire is often due to plugs as well as sticky hydraulic tappets so the ATF may have worked its magic on the tappets and it happened at the same time as you cleared the non-existent faults.
Until it changes to LPG at 30-40C, it is running purely on petrol so a cold misfire will be nothing to do with the LPG, or at least shouldn't be.

Either way, glad it is back to how it should be now! :wink: :D
Cheers,
Dave

'02 Honda CR-V SE Executive
'99 Jag S Type 3.0 V6 SE


Image
'94 827 Sterling saloon
'88 Volvo 760 V6 Estate
'95 827 Coupé LPG gone but not forgotten!

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Re: Thunderbird 2, The Green Machine & Turbo Coupes

Post by scotty2 » Tue Nov 22, 2022 2:42 pm

Well that is typical! after typing the "repair"above, the LPG stopped working again. Blooming lap when top won't connect to reset.
The LPG is programmed to cut in at >30C or when above 1500 rpm and was cutting in OK without misfire since I replaced the reducer several moths ago. The LPG guy set it up like that a couple of years ago as he noted our system heats up quickly. I'll have another play on Friday.
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Re: Thunderbird 2, The Green Machine & Turbo Coupes

Post by scotty2 » Sun Nov 27, 2022 4:06 pm

Fixed it for 5 miles then it packed in again! When the laptop did connect the Lambda was running up from 0.1v to 0.8v then start to run up again from 0.1 so I've ordered another new one.
There is still a misfire on petrol as well when warming up. I've been to raid my stash of spares and will fit a replacement coil pack, new leads and plugs to see if it's Lambda, coil pack, leads or plugs.
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Re: Thunderbird 2, The Green Machine & Turbo Coupes

Post by scoobyh123 » Sun Nov 27, 2022 4:25 pm

scotty2 wrote:
Sun Nov 27, 2022 4:06 pm
Fixed it for 5 miles then it packed in again! When the laptop did connect the Lambda was running up from 0.1v to 0.8v then start to run up again from 0.1 so I've ordered another new one.
There is still a misfire on petrol as well when warming up. I've been to raid my stash of spares and will fit a replacement coil pack, new leads and plugs to see if it's Lambda, coil pack, leads or plugs.
The Lambda sounds like it's working as it should Scott, ditto the ECU. The voltage on the Lambda should cycle between 0.1-0.9V and back again continuously at idle. I'd save your money on a Lambda sensor for now at least, especially as the Lambda won't work until it's warmed up.

Coil packs, leads and plugs would be a good start to solving the cold misfire, also try adding 2L of meths to the fuel tank as long there is 1/4 or less contents of fuel in it. The ideal ratio is 1:10 meths to fuel, this mixes (not true as you know, it miscible) with the condensation in the bottom of the tank and enables it to be burned off. As the water sinks to the bottom overnight, it's at the pick-up point so gets pulled through with the petrol on a cold start causing misfires, rough running etc.

https://www.toolstation.com/methylated- ... hstr=meths

Best price/availability on 2L of meths ^^^^^ :wink: :D
Cheers,
Dave

'02 Honda CR-V SE Executive
'99 Jag S Type 3.0 V6 SE


Image
'94 827 Sterling saloon
'88 Volvo 760 V6 Estate
'95 827 Coupé LPG gone but not forgotten!

scotty2
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Re: Thunderbird 2, The Green Machine & Turbo Coupes

Post by scotty2 » Wed Nov 30, 2022 4:27 pm

OK good news on the Lambda sensor. I'll change Coil pack, then leads, then plugs, to see what cures it, then I'll turn to meths!
The smell always reminds me of running my little Mamod steam engine many years ago...

On TB2: What is the most likely cause of annoying creaking/squeaking noise when turning the wheel and giving it a bounce?
I'll get it on the ramp on Saturday. There are a few bushes that could be the cause, just wondered what is the most likely candidate. Just turning the wheel when stationary causes it and if driving slowly in a straight line, it does it over any bump or speed bump, it does it then too.
Looks like a weekend of Rover repairs!
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Re: Thunderbird 2, The Green Machine & Turbo Coupes

Post by scoobyh123 » Wed Nov 30, 2022 8:39 pm

TGM - i'd do plugs, leads, coil pack in that order, testing in between each. Plugs are a known weak spot on the T series and the symptoms suggest HT leads after that - also the fact the misfore disappears when warm means that something isn't firing a "hard" mixture, hard because it's hard to fire a weak mixture when cold so suggest the plugs are breaking down. After that, it points to the leads. Had both cause problems on my Volvo recently, annoyingly the plugs were oler than the leads at ~15k miles and although things improved slightly, the cold misfire was still present. It also happened when hot too but not so obviously. Changed the leads on a hunch for some 14 year old OE spec leads (first set lasted 30 years/220k miles) and binned the 4 yo/12k mile Bosch leads as they cured the misfire!

TB2 - sounds like either the track rod ends or possibly the lower ball joint - urgent if the latter! They have been known to snap the pin while driving so if in doubt, change it out! If you do change the lower ball joints, make sure you add some extra grease as many seem to come through with little or no grease in for some unknown reason!
Also while the drivesahft is out of the hub, check and if necessary renew the CV boots - easier while it's already stripped that far down!
Cheers,
Dave

'02 Honda CR-V SE Executive
'99 Jag S Type 3.0 V6 SE


Image
'94 827 Sterling saloon
'88 Volvo 760 V6 Estate
'95 827 Coupé LPG gone but not forgotten!

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