Fuel filler tubes

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Fuel filler tubes

Post by SJG » Wed Oct 08, 2014 12:39 pm

Having successfully got coupe sills reproduced I am now looking at the possibility of getting the fuel filler tubes made.

I would like to know what the 4 smaller tubes are for as these are proving to be the only real stumbling block at this early stage. Any help or suggestions would be appreciated.
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Re: Fuel filler tubes

Post by dollysprint » Wed Oct 08, 2014 2:10 pm

Simon do you have a genuine workshop manual? If you do the explanation is in there, if not let me know.

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Re: Fuel filler tubes

Post by whitelion58 » Wed Oct 08, 2014 4:32 pm

http://www.rover800.info/forum/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=9632

Still not totally convinced they are completely necessary. The majority of fillers I have ever examined have these tubes rusted through, so clearly not doing very much!

Obviously it would be best to reproduce them - they are a common enough feature on other cars - but to get something functional at a fair cost they could probably be deleted.

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Re: Fuel filler tubes

Post by mercedade » Thu Oct 09, 2014 7:42 am

If I understand it correctly (and that's a big 'if'), they exist to condense fuel vapour back to liquid?

I've been meaning to delete/sort mine to eradicate a petrol smell, but never seem to get around to it.
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Re: Fuel filler tubes

Post by scoobyh123 » Sat Oct 11, 2014 9:34 am

Sadly those tubes are a necessary evil. Somewhere i have the diagram and explanation of what they are, how they work and how they are formed inside the bits you can't see from the workshop manual but i think it's all on my old PC so needs uploading to photobucket at some point.
I'm all for making life simpler and deleting the small tubes would on the face of it be a brilliant idea. However, Rover and Honda spent millions developing them and they do perform a function within the fuel system as a whole. Deleting them could result in neat fuel being fed into the charcoal canister and thus into the engine while driving. This could do untold things to the cat and also possibly cause fuel wash in the bores. Yes those are extremes and probably unlikely to happen but the other thing to consider with the way the MoT is being tightened up is that they may well become part of the test at some point. In fact, there is talk that any OBD equipped car will be interrogated during the test and while almost all 800s don't have OBD there is a rumour that the very last KV6 models may have done. I can't find anything substantial enough in Rave to confirm or refute this though. Many of you are probably wondering why that's a problem and it's simple - there are so many sensors on an OBD equipped car that it will pick up malfunctions in the PCV and fuel breather systems. I can't see the powers that be not putting something into the test to cover them if this does happen.

As for the fuel filler necks, i was going to do similar at the beginning of this year and when i posted a thread nobody seemed interested, perhaps because it was so soon after xmas. The place i got my stainless fuel filler for the coupe from was prepared to quote to make them in stainless, if it's any help i'll dig out their contact details for you.
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Re: Fuel filler tubes

Post by Alucard7002 » Sat Oct 11, 2014 12:07 pm

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Personally

Blank all apart from tube 47

Leave 47 pointing down towards the ground under the tank.

Traditional fuel tank breathing, charcoal canister can be left alone as it will simply be admitting atmospheric air rather than fuel vapour - does not affect engine side of things.

Worst that will happen is on a stinking hot day it may vent the tank pressure and it mings of petrol.
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Re: Fuel filler tubes

Post by traineefarmer » Sun Oct 12, 2014 7:52 am

Agreed. Alternatively, replace the "separator" with runs of plain pipe and never fill the tank above 2/3.
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Re: Fuel filler tubes

Post by BlueRover » Sun Oct 12, 2014 1:41 pm

Alucard7002 wrote: Worst that will happen is on a stinking hot day it may vent the tank pressure and it mings of petrol.
I'd prefer not to smell petrol near a car and I wonder if the MOT tester would notice it.
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Re: Fuel filler tubes

Post by dollysprint » Sun Oct 12, 2014 6:10 pm

I would say for peace of mind that these vapour/condensing pipes should be retained, although having spoken to someone in the know back when Pete(tenemus) was looking into this, then I was assured that never filling the tank above 3/4 would see these pipes redundant and everything safe. Trouble is as the car changes owners this information would tend to get lost in time with potentially bad consequences. However there is absolutely no reason for them to be attached to the fuel filler pipe itself and of all the rotten pipes I've seen these vapour pipes generally seem to have survived. So if sound could we not detach them from our rotten filler tubes, leave them in situ and have the main pipe remade as a seperate part? Just a thought.

Dave
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1990 Sterling Saloon 2.7 Auto black over storm
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Re: Fuel filler tubes

Post by SJG » Sun Oct 12, 2014 6:56 pm

Thanks for all the feedback, hopefully it will be okay and they will be able to make them complete.

They have said that they can make the top end - where the cap screws on and the little valve that you can see when the pump nozzle is put in the filler tube.

I will pass on all the comments.
Simon

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Re: Fuel filler tubes

Post by Richard Moss » Mon Oct 13, 2014 3:25 pm

I would imagine that it would be easy to make the breathers from copper brake pipe and clip/glue/braze them into place
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Re: Fuel filler tubes

Post by SJG » Thu Oct 30, 2014 1:50 pm

Having had several conversations I can get the main filler tube made, however they don't deal in the smaller tubes. Does anyone have any contacts or have dealt with a fuel line specialist?

If you have could you send me a link or a phone number please?
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Re: Fuel filler tubes

Post by BlueRover » Thu Oct 30, 2014 6:43 pm

If someone has an old pipe they don't need could they slice them apart and see the setup properly. From the diagram it seems there's a small "feature" at the top of two of the pipes, could they be one way valves ? Without taking one apart it would be hard to tell. Proper setup would be the best way to go if new ones are to be made, attention to detail and all that.
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