800 Owners Club

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800 Owners Club

Post by Charles827si » Sun Jul 21, 2019 7:38 am

Ive been thinking about my membership of the 'Rover 800 Owners Club' for a while.

This morning I thought I would write in a new thread about my own thoughts/experience.

I didn't want to revive an old thread because the last topic thread posted last year about the club vs forum was somewhat controversial and I would prefer to stay on the topic of the cars themselves and perhaps the body or organization; - be that a club or web forum, social media.

Anyway, I cant remember the exact time I joined the 800 owners club, but it was sometime around January/February 2017, or possibly earlier than this.

To be honest, I'm not really sure why I joined because at the time I was happy with the forum and I've never been one for going along to car meets and honestly, I've never actually taken any of my cars to a meet or rally.

This is usually because I'm concerned with the cost in fuel getting to such places. Generally speaking alot of the meets (either with the club or seperate to this) tend to take place down south.

In recent years there have been more meets locally for me.
With Facebook theres been more of an effort to organize general owners meets.

I have actually taken the decision to permanently delate my Facebook.
I saw no benefit to having an account and obviously I wasnt attending anything anyway.

Regarding my membership of the club, Ive always felt guilty of being a member and not making the effort in any way to attend meets gatherings.
In hindsight I guess I initially joined because at the time, there was a growing sense of enthusiasm to make a standalone club for the 800 model.

To be frank, I guess I joined to help nurture the club from just one off yearly club membership.

Talking about the present, the club has amalgamated with the Maestro/Montego Owners Club.

I'm not sure if I'm personally for this, because the 800 was developed as a standalone vehicle even if there was some quite minor parts sharing with the Montego.

Apart from the occasional news and service updates courtesy of Alex the Chairman via email and yearly membership pack..this is all I hear from the club.

I went to the AGM in February 2017 and that was the first and last time ive met or heard from forum members here and club members.
My messages to Tanya via fb messenger were never read to this day because of how busy Tanya seems to be with various car clubs.

Ive decided taking all the above into account, not to renew my club membership. (My paypal address for the club is no longer active since I've had to make a new account no thanks to Paypal)

And also I've taken the decision yesterday to take my Coupe off the road for the time being.
This due to all the problems Ive had as discussed in my vehicle thread.

So I have x3 800s and all now off the road, two of which are awaiting recommissioning and the mk1 827 saloon is only good for spares.

On this basis alone, ive no real reason to be a club member anymore.

Though I would always be interested to hear from club members and committee members, should they read this forum thread of mine.

Any general thoughts from all are welcome too.
Charles 'Yorks'
"88 827si Fastback (manual) - Mum owned from new
"92 827 Coupe (manual)
"88 827sli Saloon (auto)
2011 Lexus IS220D F Sport
It's a stick shift? No, It's a grip shift!
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Re: 800 Owners Club

Post by CHR15E » Sun Jul 21, 2019 8:34 am

Sounds like you're on a bit of a downer?

Specifically thinking about your cars, trying to look after multiple cars is hard work. Even worse with older stuff.

Personally I would pick the most important one to you and concentrate on that.

I've been there before, one good car will make you happier than three average/bad ones (generalising here). Also in theory once one car is up to standard it should be easier to maintain.

Something I noticed at meets was that quite often the '800 enthusiast' had cars needing more work than the people who only had one car to focus on. As soon as you start splitting your money/time across multiple cars they all suffer?

There's also a greater risk of getting itchy feet and needing a change, as I did. Personally I don't miss the cars even 7 years on, though I do miss that period of time when the forum was doing well and meets were happening.

Sometimes meets can be good for your passion for the cars as it gives you deadlines to get things sorted.

I'm not getting into a club conversation, I have nothing to do with the cars these days so I doubt anyone cares what I think anyway. :D

All based on my experience, maybe you don't agree 100%. Take a bit of time to evaluate what it is you want and where you want to be long term with your cars.
Chris
19 Vauxhall Astra 1.6T SRi Nav Estate
08 Vauxhall Astra 2.0T Design Twintop
02 Jeep Grand Cherokee Overland 4.7 V8 HO

Previously owned 57 800s 2000-2012

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Re: 800 Owners Club

Post by Charles827si » Sun Jul 21, 2019 8:51 am

I'm trying to put a brave things on things Chris :)
With my woes with the coupe and lack of interaction on the forum it's difficult to be encouraged.
There's only really Dave keeping the forum alive and Daves given me far more help and advice for nothing than anybody.
In comparison I've heard virtually nothing from the club.
It seems none of the club members are interested in the fate of my cars or what happens to them.

I however always knew I was keeping the family 800 fastback long term.
It was always a case of saving up for fixing it. Its just taking a very long time.

And I also always wanted an 827 coupe with a manual gearbox from around the age of 17 years old.
I bought K107ADU off Brad. It wasn't perfect. The car however is for keeps, because I knew even back in 2012/2013 when I was looking, I may not ever find the car with this configuration.
And even if I did find the said car (which i did thanks to the forum which I'm indebted to) the car would need alot of work.
Any car thats over 20 years old quite often will need work.
I was prepared for that, and I'm still prepared to keep the two cars for restoration, when I can afford this.
The mk 1 saloon is too far gone but I was told by the seller the 2.7 engine was running.
I could always use that engine for the Coupe.
Having said that, the saloon is an automatic, therefore the swap will be less straightforward.
Charles 'Yorks'
"88 827si Fastback (manual) - Mum owned from new
"92 827 Coupe (manual)
"88 827sli Saloon (auto)
2011 Lexus IS220D F Sport
It's a stick shift? No, It's a grip shift!
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Re: 800 Owners Club

Post by scoobyh123 » Sun Jul 21, 2019 10:23 pm

Chris has picked up on a few very good points Charles, it's often harder to keep up with multiple vehicles and then they all suffer is one of the most important ones.

As for the Rover 800 Club, the "association" started by Alex is now part and parcel of the MMOC (Montego and Maestro Owners Club) i believe but Dollysprint Dave and others i believe have started another Rover 800 Club.

https://www.rover800.club/

Besides usually being an active member on here, i understand Dave has started this club to work with the forum, rather than against it. Although not a member, i'm seriously considering it as i think that he's got the mix right, i was always unsure about the mix Alex had put toegther - seemed too focused on going to the NEC EVERY year and nothing else, no parts remanufacture, alternative parts sources (ie things from other cars that fit and work the same as the OE stuff) and so on.

I know Simon has passed the plans/details of the Coupe sills onto Dave (or at least he posted his intentions of doing so), Fastback Mark is still making 4/5 door sills and may look at the Coupe sills as an ongoing thing so there is work afoot on the new club.

Having been chatting with you via PM i totally get why you're on a downer at the moment, the biggest problem you'll face with the swap of the Mk1 engine to your coupe will be changing the driveplate to a flywheel but you have the bits so shouldn't be a problem. In fact, if the donor car is pre-cat, using the Mk2 engine management without a cat on it should give very good results, perhaps even nudging 210bhp.

I know it's a platitude but it's not the end of the world, it's a setback for sure but nothing that can't be overcome one way or another. Hang in there and it'll come good in the end! :wink: :D
Cheers,
Dave


'94 827 Sterling saloon
'88 Volvo 760 V6 Estate
All auto :D
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'95 827 Coupé LPG gone but not forgotten!

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Re: 800 Owners Club

Post by Charles827si » Mon Jul 22, 2019 5:44 am

Dave,

This is the very point that I've made in a somewhat veiled way.

There is no communication from the clubs outside of Facebook. Right? Until you mentioned that there was a new 'Rover 800 Club' (which conveniently has the word owners left out of the title) I had no idea, none whatsoever that there was even a new club.
And I'm sure there are more owners than yourself and myself who arnt on Facebook. Of course I had no idea because my FB account has been deactivated for so many months, and recently I took the easy decision to permanently delete it.

It's not a bad thing being without that particular social media, because plenty of people my age and younger don't have FB, its all instagram. I think that's where 'Alex's Club' (if you will) is headed now. Except I'm not on Instagram either.

But you know what, I won't hide the fact that I'm slightly annoyed by both Clubs.
Dave Smart could have done the courtesy of making and marketing the club outside social media. Because really, who searches for specific websites these days when everyone has 'Apps' on their Smart phones??

It does not surprise me I didn't hear about the new club. Dave Smart has never contacted on this forum in all the years I've been on here. The only time he contacted was maybe 10 years ago, to ask for the registration number of the family Mk1a Fastback for the group register.

I don't recall Dave Smart either chipping in with comments on my vehicles in any meaningful way..if at all. :?

From my experience of non car clubs, (and I'm not talking about specific people here) there is a narrow minded mentality behind nearly every committee and a pompous attitude among a select few in whatever organisation it maybe.

I don't need to be apart of that. Contribution works (and should work) both ways in an organization, and not for a select few.

Changing the subject back to cars, :) I know exactly where Chris is coming from when he suggests that it is easier to have just one car to maintain.
I said as much to Alex Sebbingar on this forum; when he was facing a similar dilemma. I said it in a more diplomatic way than others did. :)

At the end of the day, everybody does what they want. Each to their own as my wise old mother would say! :lol: :D
Charles 'Yorks'
"88 827si Fastback (manual) - Mum owned from new
"92 827 Coupe (manual)
"88 827sli Saloon (auto)
2011 Lexus IS220D F Sport
It's a stick shift? No, It's a grip shift!
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Re: 800 Owners Club

Post by Manalishi » Mon Jul 22, 2019 7:09 am

Reading this with some interest as I recognize some of the issues you bring up Charles. For me everything is a bit different as Im overseas.

Club membership: for me really no point whatsoever. I will probably (unfortunately) never meet you guys anyway. A dream is obviously to take one of the british cars and go to the UK but that would be complicated. Shelsley Walsh hillclimb in my Seven special has been a dream since I started planning the car in 1995, or Rover Coupe for cruising?

Facebook. I use it. For the above reasons. You have the cars and the meetings. We have zip-nada here. I had never ever seen a Rover 800 coupe with my own eyes when I flew 550km to buy mine. But lets face it. Facebook sucks. The posts are mishmashed and I truly hate (!) the way the topics are reviewed prior to them being posted. (In the group, a controlfreak admin?) I presume people adding a topic or a picture in a closed group follow the rules, or kick them out!?

Priority in cars, and here I hear Chris but too well: I have 6 cars. All of them need some kind of attention right now and that is really stressful.

The family car has a small blow on the exhaust. An easy fix but...

The extra family car is still on studded wheels, standing since March. And we know how much cars love to just sit in the parking lot.

My coupe has somekind of heartbreaking new fault with the transmission. Plus it needs a wash and polish.

My black Vitesse... omg where do I start!?

My Austin special has a shot dynamo. A new one is finally on its way, but that lovely car has been garaged for 2 seasons now.

The Ruby has loads to work needed too!

Best thing to do would to get rid of the Honda and the black Vitesse. And really the Austin Ruby aswell. But then, I have something unique in my collection. Not many cars but they are unique. I just cant let them go!

So there it is Charles. I think I can relate and share the frustration. And I would (if sane) get rid of at least three cars.

My way has been to accept time. I try to focus on one car at the time and have accepted that this will take years of slow progress. Age is a problem. Im not old but Im not young.

And the forum / club discussion, I must say the forum is so extremely excellent. You mentioned Dave and I agree. Dave is a fantastic guy keeping this forum alive. And he has helped us all so many times. Cheers Dave!!

And the history is searcheable. Whatever problem we might be struck by we can find ideas here. I often think about the questions asked in the Facebook group and think to myself ”why the h**l dont you get on the forum for that question?? Its so easy and elementary!”

A lot of ranting from my side, but trying to add some kind of version of the life of a man loving his machines while trying to keep the nostrils above the water surface.
Henrik
Rover 820 Vitesse Coupe 180bhp -93 (Italy)
Rover 827 Vitesse manual (non cat) -89 (Spain)
Lexus GS450h -13
Honda Accord 2.4 Executive -04
Austin Seven Special -36
Austin Seven Ruby -36
Gone:
Rover 820 ti -95
Rover 216 coupe -93
Rover 620 ti -98

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Re: 800 Owners Club

Post by scoobyh123 » Mon Jul 22, 2019 7:30 am

I became aware of the new club through this hallowed portal Charles - i don't do anti-social media at all and if i'm honest, i'm heartily sick of people who wander round glued to their phones to the exclusion of everything else.
Recent case in point spawned a new word after the third person glued to their phone wandered in front of my car while i was trying to drive out of a car park. I'd only gone 10 yds out of the space at this point too! :shock:

The intention was to shout "Get out of the way you Android Zombie!" but it came out as "Get out of the f***ing way, Zomboid!"
A semi-apologetic wave followed by hand signals to indicate they were looking at their phone ensued. They did get their Zomboid butt out of the way though!

Anyway, i digress, the point is Dave did announce the new club on here, it was in a thread that i can't remember the name of now (not helpful i know, when i remember i'll post a link) and the website has a better "feel" to it than Alex's effort IMHO.

I do agree that many clubs in general have committees "set in their ways" and as such, can be very "cliquey". It remains to be seen if Daves club will be like this, i hope not but only time will tell.

The bigger question for me is whether a club with paid membership would be useful for me when we already have this forum where information, ideas and so on are freely exchanged. :wink: :D
Cheers,
Dave


'94 827 Sterling saloon
'88 Volvo 760 V6 Estate
All auto :D
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'95 827 Coupé LPG gone but not forgotten!

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Re: 800 Owners Club

Post by scoobyh123 » Mon Jul 22, 2019 9:38 am

Found the thread where Dave first mentioned the newly formed 800 Club :

viewtopic.php?f=15&t=13279&p=153191&hil ... ub#p153191

Last page of that thread.

Apparently they are taking on the manufacture of sills for all models and wheelarch repair sections.
Cheers,
Dave


'94 827 Sterling saloon
'88 Volvo 760 V6 Estate
All auto :D
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'95 827 Coupé LPG gone but not forgotten!

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Re: 800 Owners Club

Post by Charles827si » Mon Jul 22, 2019 12:47 pm

I read this at the time Dave, but I took the conversation there as ideas for a club and nothing concrete. I hadn't taken the time to read to the last post.

I don't wish to sound doom and gloom, and I don't want to undermine the efforts of either club. These are commendable efforts by both, even if not always coherent.

The way I see the 'The Rover 800 Owners Club' where Alex and Tanya are involved at this point is a 'fringe club'. That's due to the amalgamation with the Maestro/Montego 'OC'. And somebody else pointed out on the forum that the club is a shadow of what it set out to be. I think I agree with that.

I can't understand why that would be however, when the 800 has a good but maybe underrated following.

So the reason for this lackluster club might be to do with the committee. I don't want to start a blame game. At the end of the day the members can only do what they can when they have work to go to and families and home life.

And Henrik, I'm with you the history is searchable wherever one needs to find a topic in the forum. In that respect - far easier than Facebook.
Charles 'Yorks'
"88 827si Fastback (manual) - Mum owned from new
"92 827 Coupe (manual)
"88 827sli Saloon (auto)
2011 Lexus IS220D F Sport
It's a stick shift? No, It's a grip shift!
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Re: 800 Owners Club

Post by scoobyh123 » Mon Jul 22, 2019 1:12 pm

A blame game - i think there might be more to that than you think Charles. Just my opinion based on observations but it seems people who were once active members on here no longer visit the forum since the advent of Alex's club. Faceache has a lot to answer for, a lot of people see it as some kind of Oracle and will defer to it for a quick answer. However people will eventually tire of reciting the same answers to common questions and will search for more concrete, established places where the information can be searched, questions or views aren't firstly screened by the admin and any not conforming to their strict rules (or outside their field of knowledge) are binned.

However, forums in general have taken a hit because of Faceache, once people realise anti-social media isn't the way forward, the forums will still be here.

We'll just have to wait and see what happens i suppose. :wink: :D
Cheers,
Dave


'94 827 Sterling saloon
'88 Volvo 760 V6 Estate
All auto :D
Image
'95 827 Coupé LPG gone but not forgotten!

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Re: 800 Owners Club

Post by Charles827si » Mon Jul 22, 2019 1:26 pm

scoobyh123 wrote:
Mon Jul 22, 2019 1:12 pm
A blame game - i think there might be more to that than you think Charles. Just my opinion based on observations but it seems people who were once active members on here no longer visit the forum since the advent of Alex's club. Faceache has a lot to answer for, a lot of people see it as some kind of Oracle and will defer to it for a quick answer. However people will eventually tire of reciting the same answers to common questions and will search for more concrete, established places where the information can be searched, questions or views aren't firstly screened by the admin and any not conforming to their strict rules (or outside their field of knowledge) are binned.

However, forums in general have taken a hit because of Faceache, once people realise anti-social media isn't the way forward, the forums will still be here.

We'll just have to wait and see what happens i suppose. :wink: :D
Yes if anything (rather than anybody) is to blame is Faceache - good name for it. :lol: That's why I've got rid of mine altogether. CEO 'M.Z' thinks he and his companies are the masters of the web and of course that's controversial.

Controversial for privacy, data protection, monitoring, moderating (either for good or bad). Facebook have humans to do this job as well as automated bots (whatever the term is). It's all one big police state within the web.

And obviously its worse in China these days where the citizens there feel restricted to how they interact. By them being determined 'how good they are' based on a credit score.

If a Chinese person in their home state has such a bad credit score - based on their online social media, or even how they cross the road under the gaze of cameras on every street corner, they might be barred permanently from ever flying out of the country on work, holiday, whatever purpose.

You can see why, with 'Huawei' Telecom having their roots in the Chinese Military, is worrying for American and British politicians - and rightly so to be worried.
Charles 'Yorks'
"88 827si Fastback (manual) - Mum owned from new
"92 827 Coupe (manual)
"88 827sli Saloon (auto)
2011 Lexus IS220D F Sport
It's a stick shift? No, It's a grip shift!
ImageImage

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Re: 800 Owners Club

Post by scoobyh123 » Mon Jul 22, 2019 2:49 pm

Charles827si wrote:
Mon Jul 22, 2019 1:26 pm

Faceache - good name for it. :lol:
If you like Faceache, you should hear what i call Tw@tter, Instagorm and Snapchav! Errr, you just did! :P :lol:

Joking aside, Mark Zuckerberg has created a monster, i can see where you're going and i believe our government already uses anti-social media to spy on people.

As for Huawei, i'm glad there were documents leaked about them being the supplier for our military comms, no country should ever rely on a foreign power to supply comms, weapons or anything. Part of the reason "The Donald" fell out with them and following suit, Google no longer supports their devices - thankfully i sold my P20Pro about the time it was announced by Google.
I mentioned this to someone who was getting a new phone recently that turned out to be a Huawei about Google no longer supporting them. The reply i got was "There are other search engines!" :roll:

They didn't seem to know (or perhaps care) that Google own Android so if they're not supporting Huawei (or any other brand of phone) then those devices are pretty much useless outside China that has its own form of Andloid. (Sorry, couldn't lesist! Resist even! :P )

While some may consider that as a racist comment, it wasn't intended that way - there is a genuine problem with many Chinese and how they speak and/or spell things.

Imagine using their military comms, especially a voice synthesis or voice recognition unit. :shock:

The big problem though is as you suggest, Huawei have their roots in the Chinese military - imagine what the Chinese may already be gathering by way of state secrets through Huawei mobile devices! If you've ever read "1984", you'll know about the Thought Police. Would make their job much easier!
Cheers,
Dave


'94 827 Sterling saloon
'88 Volvo 760 V6 Estate
All auto :D
Image
'95 827 Coupé LPG gone but not forgotten!

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Re: 800 Owners Club

Post by Charles827si » Mon Jul 22, 2019 2:55 pm

Yup - Orwellian Dystopia is becoming more of a global reality every month this year.
Charles 'Yorks'
"88 827si Fastback (manual) - Mum owned from new
"92 827 Coupe (manual)
"88 827sli Saloon (auto)
2011 Lexus IS220D F Sport
It's a stick shift? No, It's a grip shift!
ImageImage

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Re: 800 Owners Club

Post by scoobyh123 » Mon Jul 22, 2019 3:12 pm

Charles827si wrote:
Mon Jul 22, 2019 2:55 pm
Yup - Orwellian Dystopia is becoming more of a global reality every month this year.
Couldn't have put it better or more succinctly myself! :wink: :D
Cheers,
Dave


'94 827 Sterling saloon
'88 Volvo 760 V6 Estate
All auto :D
Image
'95 827 Coupé LPG gone but not forgotten!

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Re: 800 Owners Club

Post by dollysprint » Wed Aug 07, 2019 9:10 pm

Charles I am sorry to hear that you think so lowly of me personally, I do try to help when I can but if someone else has already posted the answer to a query then there seems little point in replicating that.
I started the new 800 Club for the reasons mentioned above regarding the direction of travel of the old club, Maestro/Montego tie up and its complete indifference to technical and parts back up, without which our cars cannot survive. Indeed the old Club has gone a step further now and incorporates Rover 600 and Honda Legend MK1. A more appropriate name for it now would be The Cowley Car Club, which I'm sure was always the intention. Alex I believe is no longer involved from what I understand. At the recent Gaydon show it became clear that many members of the old club were less than happy with it.
Rover 800 Club is the new Club, I do actually own the name Rover 800 Owners Club Ltd, a company registered in my name with Companies House and will shortly be asking Tanya to stop using my Company name.
Starting the new Club has been hard work, along with the apathy which is always present I am also fighting against an unhappy audience who had bad dealings with the old club, but please do visit the website www.rover800.club , we do also have a Facebook page for those so inclined, not my cup of tea, I prefer this Forum and promote it whenever I can.
Areas of the website are still under construction but most pages are up and running and there is a lot of technical information on there for members to view, I am currently working on a Parts Compatibility page and talking to suppliers. This does take money and time and money can only come from membership.
Rover 800 Club launched on the 5th April this year so we are still in our infancy and life does have a habit of getting in the way of our hobby but if we do not adopt a route of parts and technical back up for our cars then they will not survive and if Facebook shows you one thing its the number of owners that appear with a car, looking for parts and knowledge, can't get either and within weeks the cars are up for sale, or sadly offered for breaking.

Dave
1998 L/R Freelander 1.8 50th Edition 5dr
1990 Sterling Saloon 2.7 Auto black over storm
1993 Coupe 2.7 auto white gold 1
2005 Rover 45 GSi TD Sonic Blue-destroyed by a wanker
1999 L/R Freelander Di 50th Edition 3 dr

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